Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Businesses do not care about your efforts. They could not care less about how much time you spend on SEO. As somebody who buys services on the engineering side, I couldn't care less about the effort that somebody puts. I care about whether or not this feature is going to be finished right and built. It needs to be about results and not about effort.
[00:00:24] Speaker B: Welcome to the agency hour podcast where we help web design and digital agency owners create abundance for themselves, their teams, and their communities. This week we're joined by Mikel Dia, a digital marketing expert and the founder of Funnelytics. And in this episode, we will discuss how you can use funnels to turn a complete stranger into a customer. We explore how to get consistent results for your clients by productizing your offer, how to optimize your marketing funnel to boost conversions and ROI, and how visualizing the customer journey helps identify gaps and improve strategies, and so much more. If you're looking for some practical tips to enhance your marketing and grow your business, you're in the right place. I'm Johnny Flash. Stay with us.
Hey, Mikel, how's it going?
[00:01:13] Speaker A: I'm doing very, very well, Johnny. How are you?
[00:01:16] Speaker B: I'm doing great, man. Just, we just moved, so it's been a little chaotic over here, but it's, it's going well. We're slowly getting unpacked. You can see my whiteboard still needs to go up on the wall, but man, I'm so glad to have you on. Since we chatted a little while back, for those of maybe that just aren't familiar, can you just give a quick overview of funnellytics and the stuff that you guys are doing there?
[00:01:39] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So my name is Mikhail dia. Like, I founded a company called Funnellytics, as you just kind of mentioned. And funnelytics is really, in simple terms, a digital whiteboard. So that little whiteboard that you got on the wall there, I guess it's on the floor in this case. Yeah, we've basically built it, um, like a mirror style, kind of canvas style whiteboard where you can actually map your entire marketing files, your entire customer journeys, all the pages, the traffic sources, the actions that people take, and you can connect them together and you can overlay data on top so you can see exactly how are people flowing through all your marketing funnels. What are your conversion rates, what are the bottlenecks, what's working, what's not. So you don't have to deal with spreadsheets and charts and graphs. Uh, it's really kind of built for those marketing nerds out there. Who kind of love to look at numbers, but like, to also look at it in a visual way and, and not have to deal with Google Analytics.
[00:02:32] Speaker B: Yeah. And I think that's what I love about the funnellytics as we were going through it previously, is that, you know, just the visual part of it. Like, it's just so great to be able to see, like, okay, I want to see this getting to here. And it just kind of shows you it all in a visual way, which is really awesome. I mean, I think funnels are so important, right, in conversion and all of that, because, I mean, as marketers, as, you know, people listening to this who might build websites, like, there's just, you could make it look real shiny and pretty and everything. But, like, if it's not converting, if they're not getting through the funnel, it kind of doesn't even really matter. Right. What, what it looks like in some ways. So, yeah, let's talk about, before we get into, like, some of the funnelytics stuff, which I know you guys have a lot of, like, great features and stuff, but, um, talk about just a little bit, if you could, some of the, um, I don't want to say funnel hacks, but I mean, like, when people are trying to convert better and build their funnel, like, some people are good at it, some people think they know how to do a funnel and they maybe really don't. But just talk a little bit about that part and things that you guys have been seeing that work for funnels.
[00:03:37] Speaker A: I think the first thing that we need to get aligned around is what is a funnel? I think there's a lot of misconception of a funnel is one of five things. You can either sell a book in a funnel, or you can try to sell a little, you know, tripwire offer of like $7. Or maybe it's a webinar funnel. It's like these, they're categorized in these buckets. But really, what we're thinking about when we're, when we're creating these marketing funnels is how do we get a stranger to become a customer, right. And what are all the steps in the process to make that happen? And a lot of times we underestimate that. Like when somebody clicks on an ad, goes to a page, maybe then they go and do some research on you, and then they come back to your site and read a blog log. And that's technically still a funnel, right? It's, it's a journey that somebody takes. Now, in the more kind of Russell Brunson clickfunnels you know, you know, area or world that we kind of live in. Now, what we're really talking about is how do we architect that sequence of steps in a way that number one gets this random stranger to become a lead. So give us a name, email, maybe a phone number. And then how do we educate them and sell them onto our offer? And then how do we then make them go to the next stage and the next stage, right. So that's the first thing that we have to really kind of get around, and then we can take it back and say, okay, what are the components of a funnel? So if I want to turn a stranger into a customer, there's two components that are necessary, and then there's one that is more of a, uh, optional, depending on, on what I'm selling and, and the price point. So the first thing that we're always going to start with is our offer. Uh, how much is it? What are we trying to sell? Right? Because at the end of the day, we're trying to get a stranger to become a customer. So we need to know what we're trying to get them to buy. Uh, the price point will dictate a lot of the components of the funnel. So if something is, call it, um, $3,000 or more, it's really hard to sell it online without a phone conversation, especially if you don't have the authority, if people don't know who you are, you don't have all the reviews, you don't have all the proof, et cetera. It's really, really difficult. So usually the goal is then to move somebody into a sales conversation, and then we close them through that. So the funnel itself doesn't end when somebody just gets on a phone call. The funnel goes all the way to the sale. But part of that is we need them to apply and schedule a call with us. So now, on the flip side, a lot of times, if something is less than, let's call it $2,000, we can usually architect it so that we don't have to speak to somebody. We can get them to buy right then and there through an order form, et cetera. Okay, so the offer is the first thing that we always have to think about. Then, based on that offer, there's two call to actions to try to get somebody to buy. Either they're going to fill out a form and get on a call with us, or maybe they've scheduled a call directly into a calendar, or they're going to go to an order form and make do the purchase button. So in order for that to happen, usually what we're going to have is some sort of sales or offer page that is going to get them to either get on the phone or push the buy button. Right. So that's kind of what we call the sales aspect of the funnel. So there's the either an application portion if it's high ticket, or it's a sales portion if it's kind of lower price point. Okay. Then on the other, on the other side of it, on the kind of front end side is, well, these people are strangers. Unless your offer is super, super cheap where it's like, almost like a, you.
[00:07:34] Speaker B: Know, throwaway kind of thing.
[00:07:36] Speaker A: Throw away. Hey, here's $7. I don't really care. You're going to need to follow up. You're going to need to nurture that person. You're going to need to, you know, turn that stranger into some sort of contact that you can, you can, you know, communicate with. So on the front end side is usually some sort of lead opt in, lead funnel aspect. So usually the two most common ones are either a downloadable, like, put in your name and email, get access to this case study, get access to this white paper, get access to this free trial checklist, whatever.
Or sometimes it'll be more of like a quiz style, a calculator, something that allows me to segment you and give you maybe a bit more of a tailored experience. But the whole goal there is, I'm trying to capture their name, their email, maybe their phone number. Right now I have a lead and I can follow up with them. So those are kind of the two core components. Now, in the middle is what we kind of call the education aspect. Okay. Now, that middle portion is optional, it really depends on two components. Number one, how expensive is your offer and does it require education? Right. So, for example, if you're going to sell somebody a $5,000 coaching aspect, well, they're most likely going to need to learn a little something before they commit to, you know, buying that, that coaching program. Right. However, um, this is interesting because we, we talk to agencies, and I've ran a lot of agency funnels. Um, when you're trying to get clients for an agency, they don't want to learn. Even though your offer may be, you know, $10,000 a month, it may be $50,000 funnel build or whatever it may like. Whatever.
[00:09:24] Speaker B: Maybe it's a $2,500 a month growth plan.
[00:09:26] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:09:27] Speaker B: You're going to do some marketing for them and. Right.
[00:09:30] Speaker A: The key of what you just said though, is you are going to do the work, which means that they are not in the mindset of I want to learn something mindset.
[00:09:42] Speaker B: They don't want to know how the SEO works or the Google Ads work or whatever the thing is, right. They just want, they want to know that Johnny's going to be able to deliver the customers, make the phone ring off the hook, whatever it is, right.
[00:09:52] Speaker A: That's all they care about.
[00:09:54] Speaker B: Right?
[00:09:54] Speaker A: They care about. Do, can you actually, do you understand my problem? Do you have a solution to this problem? And do you have any proof that your solution, like, works?
[00:10:04] Speaker B: And if so, and how long is it going to take to get to work?
[00:10:07] Speaker A: How long is it going to take to get to work? But yeah, I don't care about what you're doing. I don't care about how many blog posts. I don't care about. I don't care about any of that stuff. A lot of times I kind of use this analogy for people. It's like, imagine your toilet is broken and you need a plumber. Are you going to watch a 60 minutes webinar to learn how toilets get fixed before you call the plumber? And you're like, hey, great. I now know that you need to open up the valve and switch this and do that. So can you come and do it for me now?
[00:10:37] Speaker B: Only, only my handy neighbor, who like, does everything himself, like he might watch the video on how he wouldn't need a 60 minutes video, he'd need the two minute version. Maybe he would do it himself. But me, I'm not going to go fix the toilet myself. I'm going to call the plumber. Right? And I'm not going to watch the video.
[00:10:52] Speaker A: Well, and that's the thing, right? And I think that, that your handy neighbor, his intention is different. He's not going to go and hire that plumber. He wants to fix it himself. So therefore, if you were to sell him a little course on how to be a plumber, maybe he'd go and buy that and he'd want that education component, right? So that's what I kind of say that education piece is, is very optional, depending on does the person need to be educated onto the offer? And usually the price is also going to be a big portion. And in terms of education, usually there's kind of two core education funnels that we use nowadays, which is still kind of the traditional webinar, 60 minutes webinar, or now we've kind of transformed it into like challenges or something like that. But really it's just a series of three to five videos where we're just constantly nurturing you, educating you, getting to, you know, getting you to know, like and trust us before we ask for the sale, right before we push you over to that, that sales funnel aspect. So kind of, you know, giving that, those are kind of the three core components that we look at in terms of funnels and what we've noticed in, in, you know, looking at, you know, we track about 400 and 500 million data points a month. We've got, you know, I don't know how many people have actually mapped funnels and funnelytics.
What we've noticed is every scalable and successful funnel is a combination of one of these three components. And usually, again, it's a combination of about six different things. Either it's a survey or lead generation, either it's a webinar or a mini class type of thing. Either it's an application or it's an actual sales page with an order form. And people will just kind of pick and choose these, combine them together and then drive traffic. And, and ultimately that's how they convert strangers, uh, into customers.
[00:12:49] Speaker B: Love it. That's so good. And I think, you know, as I, as I think about like some of my clients who really have their funnel dialed in, you know, it's like, it's the, it's the patio guy who has the online calculator they're driving. They've got YouTube videos that are, that are running, that are showing different things. They're driving traffic in from Google, Facebook, social, whatever to their I online calculator. And they're basically saying like, hey, it's so easy. You can get a quote in like, you know, a minute or two instantly. And they've got a nice calculator that you put in the dimensions of your deck or patio or this or that. And of course, before it's going to give you any information, you've got to put your name and email in, make sure you're in their service area, and then it's going to email you the quote, you know, so that you can't just put in the test.com or whatever and try to like, you know, get the quote without giving your information.
And it works really well for them. Right. Because theyve got it in there, theyre getting the name. And obviously, if youre building a deck or patio, at least where I live, its going to be tens of thousands of dollars. So I mean, this is like a high ticket kind of thing, right. And people may want to have some education in terms of like, what can I do on my deck? Or do I want the fire pit, do I want this or that? Theres some of that. A little bit of educational, just in terms of like what it could look like or inspirate. Maybe inspiration is like a better word, right. It's like you're redoing your kitchen. You want to see some other good kitchens before you're going to hire the kitchen remodeler possibly, right?
[00:14:14] Speaker A: Yep. And usually when it's home services, what happens is, again, that funnel doesn't end on. The funnel is all the way to a sale. Right. We always have to keep that in mind. So typically with home services, what happens is I'm going to get the lead, then I'm going to schedule some sort of home appointment. And that conversation continues. Now I'm going to come see your kitchen, I'm going to walk through and I'm going to, you know, and then I'm going to come back, I'm going to give you a quote, and then you're going to kind of sign on.
[00:14:44] Speaker B: The dotted line or get in some sequence or whatever until you sign or whatever. Right.
[00:14:48] Speaker A: Precisely right. And that's just how we need to be thinking about this idea of funnels is less about like, what is the page, what is the, you know, hook headline? All of these things, like, these things matter, of course, for conversions and optimizations. But what we really want to think about is just what are the, what is the sequence of steps? Right. How do I get this random person who's never heard of me to actually go all the way through to being customer? And in the case you just kind of mentioned, it's okay, great. I'm going to go through some sort of calculator type of quote. Then I'm going to get you an email. Then at some stage I'm going to probably get you to schedule an appointment, then I'm going to come to your house. Then we're going to have a conversation, then I'm going to go and do a proposal, and then we're going to close the deal. Right. There's the sequence. Right. Now we look at, okay, how do we track that? How do we look at the data? Where are the breakpoints? What's working, what's not is the amount that I'm spending to get that first step, that first kind of calculator step. Is it breaking down, paying off all.
[00:15:50] Speaker B: The way to the sale? Right.
[00:15:52] Speaker A: Precisely right. And is there a return? And if it, if the numbers work and I can scale it, great. That's how you scale.
[00:15:58] Speaker B: Yeah. And the data is important to track all along with, with, you know, the funnel. But also you have to have the good offer upfront. Right. Because if you don't have the good offer, like, you could have all the tracking in place and stuff, which you'll know your offer sucks because you're not getting all the way through, which is. That part's good. But we have training in agency mavericks, one of our trainings called the Godfather method. It's basically like, how do you make that offer that's too good to refuse? You know, but I think that's an important part that I think agency owners struggle with. You know, in terms of, like, what is my offer that's going to resonate and who am I pitching it to? Right. Because there's two parts. There's, like, the audience that you're trying to reach and the offer that's going to resonate with them, and then you have all the tracking, you know, through the funnel talk a little bit just about, like, that offer piece, because I think that's a part where, like, they get hung up in even the whole funnel part, because they don't have a strong offer.
[00:16:51] Speaker A: Yeah. So there's, there's a couple parts to offer. You know, being in a SaaS world, I've. I've learned a lot about, you know, product market fit. And what's interesting is in the SaaS space, SaaS space is really the only place that we use that kind of language of product market fit. But really, all we're really talking about here is I have an offer, which is my product, my solution. I have a very clear, defined market, and I have a very clear way to put my offer in front of that market. And that's really what the definition of product market fit is. A lot of people get it wrong. A lot of people think that, oh, I've sold my offer three times to the same type of person. I've got product market fit. Well, no, you don't have a way to get that customer consistently and predictably. So therefore, you don't have, you might have the, you know, the market solution fit, but you don't have the way to generate that customer consistently. So let's talk about this now from an agency standpoint. Well, the first thing that we need to realize on the agency front is businesses do not care about your efforts. They could not care less about how much time you spend on SEO. They couldn't care less about how many blogs you wrote. They couldn't care less about how many hours it took. So even if you're selling, let's say engineering talent, let's say you're selling, they do not like, as somebody who buys services on the engineering side, I couldn't care less about the effort that somebody puts. I care about whether or not this feature is going to be finished.
[00:18:40] Speaker B: Right.
[00:18:40] Speaker A: And built. And I think we need to put ourselves in that same mindset when we're selling marketing services to our clients. So it needs to be about results and not about effort. So now the question comes back to, okay, if it's about results, then what is everything I need to provide my client in order to deliver on the result that I promise to. Right. So a lot of times people think that, okay, well, I'm just going to do SEO, and, well, with SEO, you're going to get more traffic. Okay, fine, but is that the result that your client wants, is more traffic what they care about?
[00:19:21] Speaker B: No, they don't care about the traffic.
[00:19:23] Speaker A: Exactly.
[00:19:24] Speaker B: Because they'd be happy with a hundred people going to the website and a hundred people contacting them and, you know, and they'd be happy. Or it could be 10,000 people come to the website and then only have five people contact and they're probably not going to be very happy. Right. So.
[00:19:36] Speaker A: Exactly.
[00:19:37] Speaker B: They don't care the traffic.
[00:19:39] Speaker A: And that's, I think a lot of times where people get stuck, they don't understand what is the result that I'm selling. Right. And so the result can be usually in the kind of marketing space we're talking about a lead or a sale. Right. It's, it's tip. It's one of the two.
[00:19:59] Speaker B: Right.
[00:19:59] Speaker A: So it's like a marketing qualified lead or sales qualified lead or an actual sale, depending on how far you're helping people go down the journey. Now, it always ends up being a customer. They only care about customers, but depending on what you're delivering, you might only.
[00:20:15] Speaker B: Take them so far. Right. Yeah. It's like my paving companies that we work, that we do work for. Like they want a qualified lead, like whether it ends up turning into a thing. But if the person's seriously in the market, they're going to hire someone, you know, they need their, their driveway repaved or their walkway done or whatever it is, you know, then if I can get them that phone number and that person answers the phone and, you know, is legitimate, then after that it's, it's kind of. At least on those guys. Yeah, it's on them.
[00:20:42] Speaker A: Exactly. Right. And they're happy with that, and you need to be, in order to provide an irresistible offer, you need to be a hundred percent clear on what is that result that you're driving for that customer? What is that action that that person is going to take, um, for your client. Now, here's where a lot of times people make a mistake. Let's say you're doing lead generation, okay? So I'm going to come up with an offer. I'm going to maybe do some Facebook ads and Google Ads. I'll build your landing page for you. I'll do this, I'll maybe have follow up sequence, maybe I'll even set up your go high level CRM and stuff like this. And we're going to just drive some leads, right?
Okay. I would now challenge you to say, okay, well, is the word leads the right word? Is? Is it appointments? Is it consultations? Is it demos?
This now comes down to who is the person that I'm helping? Because that language is very, very important. Right? So I could go and say, I'm going to generate leads for anybody, right? Like, okay, funnelytics, your software company, I'm going to generate you leads. Okay? But what you're thinking elite is versus what I'm thinking elite is, is very different. Now, if you came to me and said, hey, Mikael, I'm going to drive you free trials for your software, now all of a sudden you're speaking the language that I care about, right? It's still technically somebody's name and email. It's still, quote unquote, a lead. They're not a customer yet. But now when you're positioning that irresistible offer, you're positioning it to me. Now, all of a sudden I have. That's the offer market fit, right? So those are kind of the two pieces that we need to really think about. And a lot of times we end up kind of sitting there and saying, well, we're just going to do leads. We do lead generation, we do this. Well, is that really what you do? If we were to take your ten best customers and your best clients, and we were to group them based on industry, we were to group them based on how big they are, how much they pay you, etcetera, I guarantee you all ten of those will have slightly different businesses. Right? And the system that you deploy to get them results will be slightly different. Maybe for one of them you had to use LinkedIn. Maybe for another one you had to use some Facebook ads and lead forms there. Maybe another one you had to set up some follow up sequences with emails and retargeting et cetera. If I want to scale my offer, my goal in an agency is always, can I like to think about it like this? Can I take the same funnelytics map and copy paste, paste, paste for every single client as much as possible without tweaking any of those icons on the map, without changing, whether there's, this is LinkedIn or Facebook or there's an opt in or this one has a follow up sequence. Because if I can do that, then that means that, number one, it means I'm getting results because I'm running the same thing. Number two, my team knows exactly how to deploy it over and over and over again, which means that it's productized at this stage. And number three, it doesn't require my brain. Now, I don't have to come in as the marketing leader to be like, let me fix this, because I'm going after construction companies. We do, you know, we help them generate RFP proposals and that is our game. And we're using that language and we have the system to make it happen. And boom, we sell that over and over and over again. That's how I like to think about offers. And that's how you create kind of that irresistible offer. It's like, it works. The system works. We don't have to tweak it. It makes your phone ring or it makes your, it gets you rfps or whatever that result that we're trying to drive is.
[00:24:42] Speaker B: Yeah, let's talk about funnels for a few moments here before we run out of time. So let's, you know, I think, um, like, like, I think it was great. We started with the kind of a definition of what it is. So we're, we're talking about the same thing. Um, what are some of the pitfalls and things that you see, like, as people are trying to implement their funnel or track their funnel? Like, you talk a little bit about that and how funlytics addresses some of those things.
[00:25:05] Speaker A: Yeah. So let, the first thing that we should talk about is, is what exactly should I be tracking?
A lot of times people track, we track like clicks and we track like page views and we track like, you know, heat maps and stuff like this. Like, what we should be thinking about is, at the end of the day, we are in the business of, again, taking a stranger to become a customer. And that stranger is a person. So our job when we're thinking about tracking is all I care about is tracking the activity that this person has done. So it should be user based tracking, not page views, clicks, et cetera. Okay, so if your software, if your tool that you're using isn't tracking a user and then looking at all the activity that that person has done, then you're not going to be able to track correctly. That's why Google Analytics moved to Ga four to be user based. Tracking Ga Universal. As shitty as Ga four is, that's the one thing they got right, is the type of tracking that you should be doing. And then in terms of what am I tracking? Okay, well, I need to track the traffic sources that send people to my site. Right. I need to track the pages that they visit, and I need to track the actions that they take on those pages. Actions can be defined as either engagement actions. So a video view, a button, click, scroll. Like, what are they doing on that page? Or the second category is what we consider a conversion action. A form submission, a calendar, booking, a purchase, an order form purchase. These are things that show that this is changing that person. Okay, so now imagine I have a, you know, I have Johnny, and now I'm tracking those three core categories. I see. Okay. Johnny clicked on a link from a Facebook ad, went to this page, then a minute later went over to this next page, watched a video on this page, then went over to this other page, then filled out this order form, made the purchase. Okay, I've got a timeline of that, right? In order for us to then see the conversion rates, to see if it's working, I need many of you. I need, I need more than one, Johnny. I need a bunch of you to kind of say, oh, look at these trends. Out of everyone who got all the way down to this purchase, it looks like that first thing that they all did was the Facebook ad. But actually a bunch of them went over to these blogs and did these other things. And. And now I can aggregate that data. Where funnelytics comes in is. Now I can visualize it on a canvas. Right? I have all of this data. But now instead of having to look at spreadsheets or I charts and try to decipher how all of these Johnny's did all these different things, I just put it on a canvas and say, let me see how many Johnnies went to this page and how many of them went on to purchase. And I can just visualize all of that journey to see what that bottleneck or that flow looks like. That makes sense.
[00:28:10] Speaker B: Yeah. And you might discover what the key actions are along the way.
Most of the visitors visit these two pages. I need to. Nobody, you know, or the people who visit this page end up bouncing out or don't come back and purchase. Right. And so you can really streamline it with your tool because it's so visual in terms of like seeing the flow and how they get from the traffic source all the way to the, you know, form submission or the purchase or whatever it is.
[00:28:36] Speaker A: Exactly. And then you could see, oh, it looks like, man, most people go to this page and like they don't, they just stop and it's like, oh, well that's when now you have to go and actually let's look at the offer, let's look at the messaging. Let's look at some of the kind of more marketing centric things, the psychology, the copy, the imagery, all that stuff to kind of say, well, why are they falling off? Like why aren't they going to the next step? What isn't working here? And then you find that out by analyzing the people who did go through, what did they do? What is the difference? The more you can dive into that data, the easier it is to tweak this over here, tweak that over there, tweak little pieces and all of a sudden this funnel starts to work really well.
[00:29:24] Speaker B: Yeah.
Let's just talk for a moment. As we wrap up here. Why don't we talk about how to get dream customers to listen in because we really want to have high performing funnels. We want to get customers to listen in. We want to have higher conversions. Um, you know, a lot of things that we talk about in agency Mavericks is like selling a growth plan, right? Like sell that 2500, that 3000, that 5000 a month thing. Oftentimes it needs some kind of maybe initial paid discovery or something like that, right. That we're kind of like taking them down this path where we're putting like a digital roadmap together for this client of how we're going to get them, all those customers that they need and, and stuff like that, and putting a plan together, painting that picture so that they're going from, oh, I thought I was just going to pay a few hundred dollars for this to like, hey, now im going to do this growth plan thats going to really accelerate my business. So talk just a little bit about that part in terms of kind of getting your dream customer to listen in and so forth.
[00:30:27] Speaker A: So just so im clear on the question, when you say listen in to like youre talking about to buy into your strategy, to buy into your services. What do you mean by listening in?
[00:30:38] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean I was just how can digital marketing experts gain actionable insights right from doing using funnelytics. And I'm sure you have some success stories that you could share about that. And just getting how, I guess, how folks have been able to use funnels to get their customers to listen in and really increase their conversions.
[00:31:02] Speaker A: Yeah. So it's, it's a good question. And in fact, it's the reason I started funnellytics. So I started funnellytics back in. The idea came to me in around 2016. And when I was running my agency at the time, what I would do is I would kind of try to explain to a client the system, the funnel that we would build for them in order to get them that purchase. And I tried all sorts of ways, presentations and trainings and stuff like this, and again goes back to, they didn't want to learn, they didn't care. They just wanted to know, does it work and do you have proof and how long is it going to take? And stuff like this. And eventually I got to a stage where we were doing these little maps on a diagramming tool, like squares to say, we're going to collect a lead here and all that stuff.
And as that was going, I realized, okay, that's getting them to listen, that's getting them to buy in because they can see it. So I actually went on Fiverr and turned, and I got just a little icon pack created of little age icons, a Facebook icon, and then I would actually use PowerPoint to draw arrows and I would create these maps. And when you show a client a strategy in a visual way, um, that instantly makes them follow along. Right? Like now, when you're explaining what you're doing, it makes them understand, okay, what does this mean? What does this look like? Now here's another hack that we did that makes it super easy to get them to say, uh, yes, it's great to show them the map. It's even better when you can put numbers behind the map, right?
[00:32:53] Speaker B: And you drive 10,000 people to this and kind of have it trickle all the way down.
[00:32:57] Speaker A: Right, exactly. If we can go and say, hypothetically, if we spend $5,000 a month or $10,000 a month, and there's 10,000 people that go here and 20% go and put in their name and email then, and these numbers across the board, this is how much money you'll make, right? When I can put numbers behind this picture, now, all of a sudden, instantly they're like, I understand how this works. I don't need to know the intricacies of what you're going to write. And all that stuff. But I understand overall concept conceptually, what you're going to do for me. So what I used to do back in the day was I would build a little spreadsheet and kind of just say, like, all right, here's formulas. Here's like a little, kind of like a calculator, like you said, like an estimate calculator. Right. Well, we've built in finally, and there's a tool also called Guru that does this similarly as well. But what we did in finallytics was we built that forecasting ability right onto that map. So now, even if I don't have my client yet, even if I'm not able to install tracking and see their actual data, I can show them that I'm data driven. I can show them that I'm result driven. I'm not just making up this stuff by saying, I'm going to build you a funnel. I'm going to, it's going to look nice and all that stuff. I'm selling them the proposition that when you work with me, you're going to get a system that is centered around numbers. That's going to get you this outcome that you care about. Right. And that's when you can get them to buy in. That's when you can get them to listen. That's when you can, like, everybody else becomes irrelevant to them because nobody else is coming to them and showing them from a result standpoint that makes sense.
[00:34:43] Speaker B: So good. So good. And I, and I love the hack, too, like, the visual part, because clients can't understand the, that what the ads are going to do in the SEO and the, you know, the, through the funnel and everything. Like, they don't, they can't see that. Right. They just, they're just kind of like, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
[00:34:58] Speaker A: Exactly.
[00:34:59] Speaker B: But when you, when you show them that, they're like, oh, okay, I, you know, they visually see it. You don't have to do it in PowerPoint anymore. You get funnelytics. It'll put all, you put all the numbers in, has the nice view and everything. That's so good. So, wow. I'm taking notes here for myself if you see me typing away. But, Mikel, anything that you want to leave us with here as we kind of wrap up, this has been great.
[00:35:23] Speaker A: No, I mean, honestly, I'll summarize by kind of saying, to really scale your agency, I think the godfather offer is a great name. You have to know. What is your offer? You also have to, as you kind of mentioned, the growth plan. And how do you kind of position and sell them a growth plan. Um, that's really what that funnelytics map is meant to be. It's like, this is your growth plan. This is how we're going to drive growth, uh, and just be focused on results as opposed to the effort behind it. It's how you can package your prices significantly higher. It's how it becomes irrelevant. A little last hack, I will say is when you talk to a client, the number one question you should always ask them is how much is a client worth to you?
Because now when I do that little calculator, it becomes really easy for me to be confident, to say, oh, your client is worth $15,000 to you. All I need is one client a month and you break even on my services. So now I can charge you 15 grand a month. I can charge you ten grand a month and feel confident because, hey, here's the system, here's the numbers. If we hit this, like, all you need is one to break even. But if we hit these numbers, you're gonna get 20. It's like, it's a no brainer. So that's why I charge you $10,000 a month. So if you have a hard time kind of increasing your prices, always think about that. Becomes really hard to increase your prices if you sell $5 dog leashes.
[00:36:57] Speaker B: Right? Right. You know, margins are low.
[00:37:00] Speaker A: Yeah, margins are low. And you need to sell a lot of dog leashes for ten grandd.
[00:37:04] Speaker B: Go. I'm glad you and I aren't in the dog leash business. But Mikel, thank you so much. This has been really great and I know it's our listeners are going to find it really helpful. So thank you so much.
[00:37:14] Speaker A: My pleasure. Happy to be here.
[00:37:19] Speaker B: Thanks for listening to the agency hour podcast and a massive thanks to Mikel for joining us. Our next live event is happening in San Diego in October, and it's going to sell out. So if you'd like to get a taste of Mavericks club and you want to tap into our amazing community of agency owners coaches training, then you want to check out the link in the description and book your ticket for Mavcon today. Okay, folks, remember to subscribe and please share this with anyone who you think may need to hear it. I'm Johnny Flash. Let's get to work.
