Unlocking Agency Success: Insights from Manish Dudharejia, CEO of E2M Solutions

Episode 108 March 12, 2024 00:36:11
Unlocking Agency Success: Insights from Manish Dudharejia, CEO of E2M Solutions
The Agency Hour
Unlocking Agency Success: Insights from Manish Dudharejia, CEO of E2M Solutions

Mar 12 2024 | 00:36:11


Hosted By

Troy Dean Johnny Flash

Show Notes

Join us as we explore the future of creativity, the importance of carving out "Me Time," and the daily routines of a CEO. Discover the transformative power of working on your business rather than in it, and learn when it's practical to reach out to a white label partner to scale your agency efficiently.

Whether you're just starting in your business or a seasoned agency owner, this episode is packed with actionable advice to help you scale, optimize your time, and prioritize mental health. Tune in to gain valuable insights and unlock new possibilities for your agency's growth.



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Episode Transcript

[00:00:00] Speaker A: We're really talking about, like, getting out of the way, right? I mean, it's really about, like, letting go and just saying, you know what? I care about this business. I really want it to do well. But if I'm the bottleneck, then it's just really limiting. Right? And it's also really draining and tiring and stressful. And when you bring on a white label partner or team members and all of that, there's just so much potential there. Welcome to the agency hour podcast, where we help web design and digital agency owners create abundance for themselves, their teams, and their communities. This week, we're joined by Manish Duhogia, founder and CEO of e two M Solutions. In this episode, we dive into what creativity might look like in the future. How you can utilize and leverage white label partners to free up your time, how to become a decision making machine, and when it's practical, to reach out to a white label partner. If you're looking to scale, it doesn't matter whether you're just starting in your business or you're a seasoned agency with the whole team supporting you. This episode is for you. I'm Johnny Flash. Stay with us. Hey, Manish, how's it going? [00:01:15] Speaker B: Hey, Johnny. I'm doing fantastic. Thank you for having me again. Excited to. [00:01:20] Speaker A: Oh, man. [00:01:21] Speaker B: Excited to speak with you. [00:01:23] Speaker A: It's like the highlight of my week. I get to talk to Manish and I always learn so much when I get to hang out with you. And you're very generous with your time and your wisdom, and so I'm looking forward to it. I would love to just hear anything that you've been up to, anything. Just kind of on the side. Doesn't even have to be work related, but would love to just hear what you've been up to. [00:01:47] Speaker B: I think my deep interest and more about towards the philosophy towards psychology and spirituality, there are three areas are my deep interest outside of the work. So I am a deep thinker. And whenever I kind of get a time, kind of go in a wondering state and think a lot about, like, so we still don't fully understand creativity and intelligence and specifically in the era of AI. So right now, I've been kind of like, thinking a lot, seeing a lot around the human mind and the potential of AI, what it is going to look like. [00:02:46] Speaker C: Right. [00:02:49] Speaker B: Those are the areas where definitely I'm more involved and it's more about, like, we literally sometimes feel like we are kind of in a vicious circle. [00:03:03] Speaker C: Right. [00:03:03] Speaker B: If you really look at your day, you wake up in the morning and then you have a thing lined up till you kind of like crash into the bed. [00:03:18] Speaker C: Right. [00:03:19] Speaker B: And where are you getting time for yourself? [00:03:21] Speaker C: Right. [00:03:22] Speaker B: Where are you getting time to just think where you are just by yourself, you are not doing anything and you are literally thinking something and you are literally in the state of brainstorming, not related to just business, but in general about life. Right. So I'll always wonder. I try to find time into that so that I have some time every day, which is kind of like my me time. [00:03:55] Speaker C: Right? [00:03:56] Speaker A: Yeah. Because when we have our time maxed out, right. We kind of end up becoming like a rat in a wheel where we're just running and running and running to keep this thing spinning and we don't have the room for the creativity and just reflection and all those things that we all need, even though we sometimes think we can get away without it. We think we can work 80 hours and it's not going to kill us, but it's going to wear us down. Right. Yeah, I think you're totally right about that in terms of just kind of being able to self reflect. I know a lot of the agency owners that I'm coaching and I talk with and so forth, they kind of oftentimes feel like they're working six, seven days a week. They're missing family time. They can't hardly put their computer down. They definitely can't sometimes go on a vacation without their computer or their work following them, worried that everything's going to melt down if they don't work all the time. And of course, in mavericks, we're coaching them to have boundaries and all those things. But I think that is a real challenge of just trying to free up your time and let go and empower people and all that. And so I'm kind of curious for you, thinking about those agency owners and trying to free up their time thoughts that you have on that. [00:05:17] Speaker B: Yeah, that's a really great point. And that is something I'm personally obsessed about for more than one and a half year. I started realizing one and a half year ago that, okay, how can I have more control on my time? How can I free up my time? I think one and a half year ago, I read something very interesting and which kind of stuck into my mind is kind of like, busy calendars are creativity killers. It literally kills your creativity because our minds are wired in a way where when you know that, okay, you have things lined up, if you have like five meetings on your calendar, then your mind will always start thinking about that. I don't know if you absorb that or not. But for instance, if you have a meeting at noon, then you will start thinking about it from morning itself. You will start planning your day accordingly. And pretty much like previous 30 minutes, which is like from 1130 to twelve and pretty much like post 30 minutes, you will end up doing nothing because all you have in your mind is like, okay, I have a meeting at twelve, right. And imagine if you have five of such meetings in a day, pretty much like those 5 hours of meeting and another couple of hours, just like blocking of your mind, which is thinking about those meetings. It kind of like kills another couple of hours as well, right. So that kind of got me to the point where, okay, how can I free up my time? And obviously, like, you know, if you want to free up your time, you have to delegate. [00:07:03] Speaker C: Right. [00:07:04] Speaker B: You. And which is the most difficult thing, right. When you are a kind of a. You believe in perfection. When you do things by yourself, you don't usually trust someone very easily. Not because you don't trust them, but just because you are so much obsessed about doing things in a very particular way. [00:07:25] Speaker C: Right. [00:07:26] Speaker B: Which you cannot anticipate. [00:07:27] Speaker A: And you care a lot. [00:07:28] Speaker B: Yeah, you care a lot. [00:07:29] Speaker A: Right. [00:07:29] Speaker B: With all good intentions. [00:07:31] Speaker A: You care more than with all good intentions. [00:07:34] Speaker C: Right. [00:07:37] Speaker B: But that kind of more of an emotional angle where you are becoming an obstacle for your growth. [00:07:46] Speaker C: Right. [00:07:46] Speaker B: So I think that's definitely a struggle. That's definitely a challenge, which I have been to as well. But how I kind of got over that challenge where I have a pretty much lot of free time right now because I realized that when you are too much busy, you are actually working in your business. But when you free up your time and start working on yourself and when you start having a free up your time, then you are actually working on your business. [00:08:19] Speaker C: Right. [00:08:19] Speaker B: Because if you have a free time, then you will think like hundreds of other ways to, how to scale and grow your agency business. Like maybe going after a different market, maybe introducing a new service, maybe changing a business model, maybe doing something new. [00:08:34] Speaker C: Right. [00:08:36] Speaker B: Believe me, ever since I freed up my time, I have been getting more busy than I was used to be earlier. But now I'm actually getting busy on things which I really want to do it, which are like working on business, not working in business. [00:08:53] Speaker C: Right. [00:08:53] Speaker B: Obviously I've been doing this since last 1012 years, so it took me a longer to get there. But at some point you have to start. [00:09:02] Speaker A: Yeah. And I was just going to say the pushback that I get from some agency owners or even people working in an agency, maybe they're not the owner. Maybe they're kind of in the leadership team or whatever is that. Hey, my team is already maxed at capacity. I can't slow down because if I don't make sure these plates are all spinning, they're going to fall on the floor because my team is maxed out. I don't know what to do. I feel like I'm at my max capacity with that response. How do you kind of steer them in the right direction? [00:09:38] Speaker B: Yeah, you definitely don't want to stop your growth. When it comes to bandwidth. Obviously the first thing comes to you need more people. [00:09:47] Speaker C: Right? [00:09:48] Speaker B: So obviously, traditionally you can hire someone full time or there are other options, like you can hire a freelancer or you can hire a contractor, or you could have a strategic white level partnership, just like how we are at e two m what we do with agencies, right. So I think you really want to figure that out. Like, okay, is that a temporary bandwidth issue or is that a permanent bandwidth issues? [00:10:16] Speaker C: Right. [00:10:16] Speaker B: And regardless of that, you really want to have someone strategic who is available on time. [00:10:24] Speaker C: Right. [00:10:24] Speaker B: So there are pros and cons of working with everything. There are pros and cons of working with having full time employees, contractors, freelancers. Right. If you have an inconsistent volume, having full time employees won't make sense, right. If you kind of like working, if you think like, okay, I need more reliability where I can have a team on demand when I want, then freelancer or contractor might be a trouble. Specifically freelancer, because then they are occupied working with so many different projects and everything. [00:11:04] Speaker C: Right. [00:11:04] Speaker B: And then contractors usually are blocked in a certain amount of time. [00:11:10] Speaker C: Right. [00:11:10] Speaker B: So that's where you definitely, it's not something I'm saying because that's what we do. But I have seen that agencies coming to us that, hey, we have burned with our hands and with these kind of experiences and then they want to try a white label partnership. So that's definitely a way to go when you want to max at capacity. It is just like that. What you really want to make sure that in order to give the consistent experiences to your clients, you really want to communicate your requirements, your specifics and your challenges to white label partners. So they kind of become a part of your team and they don't look like just another outside of team. [00:12:00] Speaker C: Right. [00:12:00] Speaker B: So you really want to work with a white label partner who want to adopt your processes, want to be a part of your project collaboration tool who pretty much become a part of your team overnight and just plug and play into your agency and literally scale your agency overnight and solve the bandwidth issues overnight. [00:12:24] Speaker A: Yeah. And I think that can work for a business of any size. Right. Because someone just starting out, maybe they don't want to have to do all the things. They can have a white label partner like e two m do the work. It could be an agency that has some contractors or team members that sometimes there's not enough bandwidth for all the stuff coming in, they've got that partner and then even larger agencies. I think it works really well because it's just sort of this scalable component of your business. Right. That you can kind of utilize when stuff gets to be crazy. So I love that. And I think we're on the same page with that. That's why I love just talking with you. And I know a lot of our mavericks are using e two m because it's just a great service. [00:13:11] Speaker B: Yeah, I think regardless of the size, I'll kind of classify that thing. [00:13:16] Speaker C: Right. [00:13:16] Speaker B: That if you are just starting an agency owner, Max, and we were talking just earlier about it as well, that let's say if someone is just starting out and you are figuring out, like, at what point you really want to try out white level partnership, then think like that. If you are starting out, it actually makes more sense because then you actually need multiple expertise. For instance, if you have a website project, then you need a designer, and then you need a front end developer, backend developer. You need a QA analyst for quality analyst. You need a server guy to launch websites. So technically you are talking about hiring five different people. But then if you are working with an experienced white label partner and they have all this figured it out, so you don't have to find five different people. [00:14:01] Speaker C: Right. [00:14:01] Speaker B: So I think as long as you have a project on board, you really want to think about it that, okay, I really want to get this entire project done from one team where they just get it done. [00:14:15] Speaker C: Right. [00:14:15] Speaker B: And if you are like meat size to large size agency, then also usually a lot of time it happens. We work with meat to life size agencies. Then they have a team of project managers, account managers. Sometimes they have designers as well. And all they want is like, okay, a development team. Because they feel like, okay, we really want to be a front facing to clients. Right. Where we have sales figured out. We have a really good project management team. In fact, we have a designer as well. Now, development is something is like very time consuming. And we are having a hard time to find different tech expertise in the constantly evolving tech. [00:14:54] Speaker C: Right. [00:14:55] Speaker B: Because sometimes you got a project client says, okay, I need a WordPress website. Then you need a WordPress developer. And tomorrow a client says, I need e commerce website in Shopify. So you need a Shopify developer so you don't want to go and hire that developer. [00:15:10] Speaker C: Right. [00:15:11] Speaker B: Instead, if you have a strategic partnership, then they have all these kind of like text pool resources so you can utilize them really well. So to answer your question, yeah, regardless of the size, you can leverage white label partnership to free up your time. And I think if I really want to, I use this framework to freed up my time, right. So there is a one thing. If you are specifically, if you are a single agency owner, right, I want you to think about it. You cannot become rich or you cannot create a wealth by renting your time, okay? It is something where you really want to invest your time into something creating, right? When I say creating doesn't mean your clients projects, clients websites, right? It has to be something like you should be getting paid for something which you are spending time on, where you will get a return of that time for a very longer period of time, right? So you really want to make sure that you are not occupied or completely in your business where if you just take a week off and then everything collapse, right. Then you are definitely in a bad situation and that's not going to help you move the needle and get to the next stage. You just have to figure out like I have to find out. And the best way to free up your time is remember, this framework is find someone who loves to do what you hate to do, right? So think like that. When agencies come to us and they are like we are burned out, we don't have a time to, we really want to focus on growing and sales scaling our agency. Some of the agencies we work from, Mavericks community and they say our coaches are helping us a lot. We have a lot of great strategies in our place. We just need to free up our time and we hate to do all this work. And guess what, we tell them that hey, we love to do it actually. So find someone who loves to do what you hate to do and then you are creating a truly win win because it's not something that you want to free up your time because you literally hate to do, right? You really care for your clients with all good intentions. You want to keep things on your hand because you care for your clients. You really want to deliver the quality things, but you have some sort of threshold, right? You cannot do all that alone. You cannot have hundreds of projects of going on. If it's just you definitely need a team to scale. [00:18:03] Speaker A: Yeah. And I think we often make the mistake. We bring on a white label partner like e two m or we hire someone or whatever we do, and we think, like, oh, they're just going to suddenly do everything the way that we want them to do. Read our mind, kind of know all the things that need to happen, and we're kind of asking for failure. I think we kind of ask for failure when that happens because it's like, who can go into anywhere and know? I mean, imagine, like, any other situation, right? I like to cook food on the grill, right? But if I went and got a job as the chef in the back doing the grilling at the place, I might not make the burgers or the chicken or whatever. The thing is the way that they want it made there, even though I think it tastes pretty good and it's the way I do it. Right. It's like I would need some direction on, this is how we usually do it, or these are the expectations or these are the boundaries, or these are the best practices that have worked well on whatever. [00:19:02] Speaker C: Right. [00:19:02] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:19:02] Speaker A: And so it's like, I don't know why we think we can just hire someone and then everything just magically solves itself. Right. [00:19:11] Speaker B: That's a really good point. And from my personal experience, this is a very common situations we see not all the times, but sometimes where agencies think that, okay, once we have white level partner and that they think, like, everything is going to be really great. So I think a couple of my experiences I would like to share how to make it, like, win win, right? [00:19:38] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:19:38] Speaker B: So first of all, think like that. When you really want to delegate, you really want to shift the mindset, right. That you really want to understand that you are delegating to someone who is not you, who is not going to do the exact thing, just like you. [00:19:58] Speaker C: Right. [00:19:58] Speaker B: The whole idea of delegating is like freeing up your time, right? So specifically, if you are a perfectionist, if you believe everything has to be perfect, right? And that's how I was, and I still. I am, right. But it's like my core background is in SEO, right? So when I actually started getting off from SEO, I was handing over projects to SEO team. I was like, okay. Or even like early days when I was hiring for our company, I always tried to find someone who is exactly like me, and that was the biggest mistake I was making. [00:20:34] Speaker C: Right. [00:20:35] Speaker B: Think like that you really want to create a diverse team because you are already there. You really want to hire people who come with different ideas, although they are not as perfect as like you, but at least they are helping you to scale your business, right? And you are having a diversity in the team. So I think one of the first thing you really want to have the mindset that, okay, hey, they are not exactly going to do exactly how I want. However I can put together my processes. I can tell them that, hey, these are the obvious thing I don't want to make mistakes around. These are the things I really want to take care of it, right. And the best thing I would do it like, hey, this is the recent, for instance, if you are handing over a website development project or an SEO campaign, then the best thing, I always advise agency owners that tell your white label team that hey, this is the last website I developed, this is how exactly I want you to do it, right. So then you are giving them something to look at that what your standards look like. If you have your standards processes, that's super easy, just tell them. But you cannot expect them to read your mind and do it like how you are doing without providing them any information. You cannot just tell them that hey, here is the design, here's the scope of work, go ahead and do it. You have to tell them that, hey, I use elementor as a builder or DV as a builder. I want to make sure that you use the same builder. I use x number of plugins. So at least the most common things you really have to tell them to make sure they are on the same page. And despite of doing all these things, you really want to make sure there is always a learning curve when you are hiring a new team, right? And think like that, there will be a chances of a failure when you are trying something new, at least 1%. So then you are mentally ready that, okay, if something goes wrong, okay, we'll fix it. [00:22:35] Speaker C: Right? [00:22:35] Speaker B: But the damage should not be done too much, right? And sometimes it happens like you have had a really bad experience working with white level partner and oftentimes this happens, agencies come to us and hey, we have burned our hands and like that. And I just tell them one thing. If you went out to the restaurant, if you tried something, you tried a dish and you did not like it, that doesn't mean you stopped going out to the restaurants, obviously, either you will try a different dish in the same restaurant or you go to the next restaurant, but you'll not stop going to the restaurants, right? It's kind of like that. Sometimes you might have. Yeah, go ahead. [00:23:20] Speaker A: Yeah, let me just add on to that, because I think it's a perfect analogy, what you said. And I think to take it one step further, sometimes we have the bad experience at the restaurant and we don't then go into the back of the restaurant and say, I'm going to cook it the way that it needs to be done because it's our tendency. Like it doesn't go quite right, and then we just try to yank it back or fix it ourselves, which then just means we're stuck fixing it all the time, right, because we haven't empowered whoever to do it, right. It's like even if someone has e two m do something and something doesn't go quite exactly the way they want it, if they just go and fix and do the thing themselves, you and your team don't learn anything from that, right? And just like if I yank something from one of my team members, they're not learning about what they did, right, or how they could have done it better because I just jumped in and solved it, right? Which it kind of short circuits the learning and the empowering. Right? [00:24:19] Speaker C: Yes. [00:24:19] Speaker B: So here the communication is the key, right? That the communication and collaboration is the key that, okay, if something goes really wrong, you really want to communicate loudly about it, make the team aware about it. It shouldn't be like where you assume that this team is not capable at all, right? Because sometimes it's just the communication gap, right? Sometimes when you actually get on the call, then you realize that, okay, it was just about the communication. So I think initially you really want to have a clear mindset that, hey, I'll have to spend some time, or someone from my team has to spend some time with this team to make them understand how we want things to be done. And the best way, like I said, is either you just show them what you have done so they know exactly how you want, or just provide them any supporting documents, processes, Sops, you have it, or if you don't have it, then sometimes use their processes and Sops. So a lot of time agencies, startup agencies come to us and they say that, hey, we want you to use the best practices. We don't have Sops. And we tell them, hey, we have our own processes, why don't you use them so you can actually leverage their resources as well when you are working with experienced team like us, right? So it's just about making your mindset that, hey, you are trying something new. It's kind of like in general, in life, in business, when you try something new, there is always a chances of failure, right? But when you know, okay, I'm trying something new, I might fail. Then at least when you fail, you won't feel bad. You know that. Okay. I knew it. That there was a 1% chance of fail. But then you always think about what to do, make sure to minimize that failure. [00:26:08] Speaker C: Right. [00:26:08] Speaker B: And it's always an initial time. [00:26:10] Speaker C: Right. [00:26:11] Speaker B: Then once you are in sync with team, then it just feels like they are a part of the team. [00:26:19] Speaker A: Yeah. And if you're doing all this on your own, trying to just isolated, trying to figure it out, it's really hard. Right. And I think that's why community is huge. Right. Because if you're around other agency owners, if you're kind of learning best practices in the industry and you're not just trying to. Because the path is. We were talking before we started even pushing record the path to running an agency, it's pretty well worn. It's not like you're trying to get the first spaceship to Saturn or something, and you're trying to chart a path that's never been done before and getting a person to Saturn or something. Right. This is a well worn path. And so I think when we make the mistake of trying to go it our own way or try to just figure it all out, you can do that, but you don't have to. Right. You can be in community. You can be in coaching. You can be in training. You can go to live events. There's so many things that you can do to kind of surround yourself. And I would say, when I was younger, I'd played video games, and there was this game Mario Kart, and you'd play Mario Kart, and there's, like, these shortcuts, right, where you can go the normal track way, but then there's, like, if you go through the bush or you jump up this thing, you cut off half the track and you shortcut. [00:27:35] Speaker C: Right. [00:27:36] Speaker A: And I think when you're in community, that's just kind of a natural outflow that helps you in all of these things that we're talking about. Right. [00:27:43] Speaker B: Yeah. Community is the best thing. I think here we are more talking about that when we say that. Okay. When you really want to do it, talk to someone who has already done it. [00:27:55] Speaker C: Right. [00:27:56] Speaker B: So oftentimes it happens when agencies come to us and they say, hey, we don't know how to work with your team. And then we guide them. This is how we do it. And then we let them speak up with our other agency clients as well, because we have a community of over 200 agencies, and now one of the things which we are starting newly is like we are starting a slack channel for all of our clients where they will be getting, interacting with each other. It's kind of like agencies will get help from each other. Just like questions about general, about agency, right? And then there is a community like agency mavericks as well. So where you can actually talk to other peers that, hey, I really want to free up my time. I want to really hire a team. And how do you guys work with them? [00:28:48] Speaker C: Right. [00:28:48] Speaker B: So that gets you a validation. Sometimes you can use their tools, processes, practices as is to make it successful. Oftentimes it happens, agencies come to us. Then they say that, hey, we heard about you from this agency. They are using you. We need exact team, we need exact processes. And it obviously makes successful as well. So I think the communication is just. I so agree with you, Johnny. That agency, kind of like owner's life, is very much isolated, right? And if you are a part of community, then you always have someone to go after and someone to talk with and someone to take at least their opinion. And then the best thing about specifically agency Mavericks community, I have seen everyone super helping people. The sessions which I actually have seen attended in live events. The other agency owners are actually showcasing their blueprint, like how they are exactly running agency, how they have set up their click up. Right. Which is super useful for other agency owners because then they don't have to figure out what the other agency owners have already done. They just have to mimic it to make it more easy for them. [00:30:13] Speaker A: Yeah, no, and I think it's huge and you've been a huge just supporter and fan. I just have to say thank you because you've come alongside and you've kind of added jet fuel to what we're doing with agency mavericks and trying to help agency owners. And I know in that way we're very aligned in terms of what you're trying to do and who you're trying to help. And we're trying to do the same thing. And so I just so appreciate that about you. And while we're talking about the live events, I'm just going to drop in. We've got, as you know, our event in Australia on the Gold coast in June. It's going to be June 17 and 19th. It's going to be amazing live event and good portion of our team and Troy are going to be there and it's going to be awesome. A lot of Mavericks will be there and we do have opportunities for those not in mavericks to come and attend and just get to learn and grow their agency, and it's going to be awesome. And then our event in the United States, which I'm super excited about, too, will be in San Diego in October, in mid October, and that's going to be fantastic. And I'm hoping that you and I get to hang out. [00:31:21] Speaker B: Absolutely. [00:31:21] Speaker A: Again and do fun stuff. So lots of great ways to just kind of connect and attend a live event. You can go to agencymavers.com to get all the details. I'm sure we'll have it in the show notes as well. But as we're kind of wrapping up here, anything else, Manish, that you want to just sort of gold nuggets that you want to drop in here? Just in terms of, as we're talking about, we're really talking about getting out of the way, right? I mean, it's really about letting go and just saying, you know what? I care about this business. I really want it to do well. But if I'm the bottleneck, if I'm the chief bottle washer and have to do all the things, then it's just really limiting, right. And it's also really draining and tiring and stressful. And when you bring on a white label partner or team members and all of that, there's just so much potential there. And so just kind of any sort of final thoughts with all of that? [00:32:23] Speaker B: I think you won't realize something until you have it right. So freedom is some sort of like that. Freedom is something you will only realize the potential of freedom when you will get it, right. So I'm not saying it might not be possible for everyone to get it overnight, but at least you can start working towards that, right? So if you are like, working, let's say 60 hours a day, just figure out how to take it to 40 hours, right. If you are doing like 40 hours a week, figure out how to take it to 30 hours and then 20 hours, right. And then you will really start seeing the importance of those 10 hours that how much that free up freedom time of 10 hours is going to help you. Not only help you grow your agency, but actually those 10 hours will help you think clearly because then you will start making a lot of great decision. Because think like that as an agency owner, you are actually a decision maker machine, right? You have to make a lot of decisions. And right now, if you are too much busy, how are you going to make thoughtful decisions? [00:33:37] Speaker C: Right. [00:33:39] Speaker B: In decision making, there is always some psychology. It says, like, second order thinking. Second order thinking is like when you are taking any decision, you always think about consequences of after taking the decision, right. That, okay, if I'm taking this decision, what's next? And then you start thinking about the next. Not exactly about the decision, right. So those are the things that requires a lot of time to think clearly. So I would say, like, think like that. Busy calendars are creativity killers, right? Your goal is to free up your time. How to free up your time? Find someone who loves to do what you hate to do. And when you get a freedom, remember, you are going to get into a boredom stage initially. [00:34:30] Speaker C: Right. [00:34:31] Speaker B: But don't worry, boredom will get you to a creativity stage again. Creativity will help you to be more productive. [00:34:40] Speaker C: Right. [00:34:40] Speaker B: But that productivity will lead to another level of growth as well. So I would say 2024. We still have, like, ten months. The number one goal of you as an agency owner must be, like, freeing up your time, which will really help you to level up not only your agency, but you will see a personal growth, and I definitely see increase your mental health awareness as well. [00:35:09] Speaker C: Right? [00:35:09] Speaker B: So that's something I would highly, highly recommend to. [00:35:13] Speaker A: Wow. Wow. Ladies and gentlemen, if you listened all the way to the end, you got the gold nuggets right there. That was just so good. What a great wrap up to this. Manish, always a pleasure. Thank you so much. And I'm looking forward to hanging out with you again soon. [00:35:28] Speaker B: Absolutely, Johnny. I look forward to it. Thank you so much for having me again. Really appreciate. [00:35:34] Speaker A: Thanks for listening to the agency hour podcast and a huge thanks to Manish for joining us. I always love catching up with Manish, and he's so generous with his insights and wisdom. And I always catch myself taking notes throughout our conversations. Manish is going to be at our live event in Mavcon in October, too, so I can't wait to catch up with him in person. Okay, folks, remember to find someone who loves to do what you hate to do. And of course, please don't forget to subscribe. And please share this with anyone who you think may need to hear it. I'm Johnny Flash. Let's get to work.

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